3 days off Suboxone, help appreciated!

So I guess from reading here for a while I may be a rare case, or at least I hope. Sunday night was my last dose of suboxone, that’s right 9/11 was when I jumped off and yes I jumped off. I really can’t talk bad about the drug since it kept me away from street drugs AND alcohol for 20 months now. But with that it did come with some side effects that I just over time got plain sick of. I have been taking 12mgs every day for the last 20 months. I’m now sitting at 72 hours since my last suboxone and honestly I’m not feeling that bad, which scares me. This will be the second time coming off them and I remember last time it was HELL. I know I was taking the pills then and now I’m taking the strips, wonder if that has something to do with it. I’m actually really scared that the major withdrawals just didn’t hit yet.

Of course I am somewhat depressed and don’t really have much energy but it definitely doesn’t seem as bad as the last time. Does anyone know when you start feeling the major withdrawal? I was under the impression that the half life was 36 hours so I would be feeling like total crap within 36 hours. I only have off work until Monday so I really hope I’m able to go to work. Does anyone know if coming off Suboxone would make me eligible for short term disability? Thanks in advance for any help…frank

Hi, I hate to be the one to give you bad news but most people stopping from that high of a dose do not start feeling withdrawl until 3 or more days from stopping. The reason is the stacking effect, you have much more sub in your system that 12mg because of the 36 hour half life. SO if you take 12mg, 36 hours later you still have 6mg in your system. For simplicity say the half life is 24 hours, so day 1 you take 12mg, on day 2 when you take 12mg you still have 6 mg lest so you really have 18mg in your system. Day 3 you take 12mg you still have 9mg in your system so now you have a total of 21mg. So you can see your doses continue to stack and you have alot more sub in your system. 12mg is high dose to stop taking sub. I really hope you get out of this pain free but unfortunately I do not think that will be the case. As far as I know withdrawing from Sub will not qualify you for disability. Please post any questionsyou may have or if you just need some support while going thru this hard time.

Yes, like Breez_Ann said, three days is the norm for the withdrawals to really kick in. I would take some now and taper down nice and slow like you're supposed to or you are setting yourself up for a really nasty time.

Kicking from that high of dose will be tough. Are you really sure this is the best way to go about this? It will take a lot of motivation to get past the w/d's.

I wish you'd reconsider and go about it the right way. But it's your choice.

Good Luck!
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Moderator status does not make me a professional when giving opinions about Suboxone treatment. My opinions are based upon experience.

I have to agree with the others, that your acute withdrawals probably haven't started yet. And I also agree that 12 mg is a very high dose to jump from. That said, I do know a couple of people who quit at that dose and did relatively OK. One person I'm thinking of only took half a day off work and that was to go to get some Clonidine. It just depends on your individual body chemistry and make up - everyone is different. Stay distracted, active, and as busy as possible. And get with your doc for some clonidine - that should help you greatly.

As for short term disability, it depends on what your particular coverage requires as well as if and how your doctor will approve such a leave. It is possible, I suppose, that you could get disability for it, but obviously I can't say for sure. You can always check in with your HR office and ask for the necessary paperwork and then get with your doctor. Again - these are just my thoughts based on my own use of disability some time ago.

Good luck and let us know how you're doing. I sincerely hope your acute w/d aren't that bad.
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-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.

Hey!
Congrats on the jump. By now you probably are settling in for the haul. I jumped cold at 8mgs--which I understand isnt that much different from 12mgs in terms of WDs. I hated the first 10 days--but I got through it, Days 5-10 were the hardest for me--and then after that the next couple of weeks were still times of great fatigue and stomach issues--BUT...my mind began clearing and I could tell things were turning. You can make it. But you have to hate the drug more than the pain of getting off it. Keep your goals in mind. I took no other aids--except for Trazadone for sleep. It wasnt fun--but I knew that the few days of discomfort were nothing in comparison to getting my life back. Good luck and stay hard. You can do it.

Thanks for the reply everyone…don’t get me wrong, I feel far from normal. I just don’t feel as bad as I did last time when I weaned off. Right now I’m right about 96 hours (4 days) since my last dose of sub (4mgs) I’m honestly not sure why. Last time when I weaned off it was withdraw every time I lowered the does. I guess jumping off was better for me. I feel like I go through one withdraw and I’m done. I guess everyone is different but I honestly don’t feel that bad (fingers crossed) and don’t see it getting that much worst. Right now I’m slightly depressed, have diaria, and ressletless leg syndrome. I remember from last time the RLS was what took fooorever to go away, that I’m not looking foawrd too. IDK, I will try and report on my progress from time to time for those that care. On another note, it’s also been 4 days since I had a cigarette. IDK, I’m on a roll right now, and as much as it hurts I feel it’s the right thing for me to do.

PS: My HR department wil not even call me back. So much for 7 years loyalty to the company. Oh well, that’s another story.

One thing at a time bro. Remember you are like a car going down the highway that has problems. You cant fix the car while it is moving. Take time to heal as best you can. For me there was NOOOO way I would taper--I always drifted back to max dosage. True addict lol SO I jumped. Everyone is different like you said--and it sounds like you are on your way. BTW--I didnt smoke--but I lost my huge addiction to coffee and still cant drink it. Weird.

brian

lol Brian that is exactly my case also. I would never be able to taper, I would keep jumping back to my max dosage or even higher. I mean Ive really been trying to taper for about a year now and it just hasn’t worked. I know I’m not doing it the “proper”way but I am really happy to hear about someone else that was able to jump off and is now OK. Funny I also drank way more coffee while on subs. I actually did way more of everything on subs. Anyway, I haven’t even wanted to look at coffee the past 4 days. I figured it was because I’m withdrawing but maybe I will kick that habit also…but like you said one thing at a time. I’m just glad I chose to stop. I feel pretty bad right now but I can take it for the payoff…thanks again and stay safe…

Hi substation. You and Brian are by far not the only ones who have jumped from a high dose because they couldn't deal with the taper. Some people report that the physical WD's aren't bad compared to full agonists. Some people have a rough time and tough it out, and some people go back on and taper lower. Maybe Romeo will chime in soon. He went off a high dose a year ago and has been doing fairly well. Interestingly, I've heard people say that after the first time going off of Sub has fewer physical withdrawals. I'm not sure why, but I've heard more than one person say that. They say that with subsequent times going off that the psychological aspects can get worse.
It sounds like you have a good attitude, and I would guess that by day 4 or 5 it's probably as bad as it's goi g to get. I would be very interested in hearing your updates as I'm having a hard time sticking to my taper, too. Hang in there, get outside as much as you can, and good luck.
Lilly

Thanks Lilly and everyone….I really can’t say in words how much you guys/gals are helping me right now. I feel like I wanna cry, and if you seen me you would never believe I would cry lol not really….anyway, yes of course I know we aren’t the only ones. I was just glad to hear that someone else was able to chime in saying they did the same as me and I’ll be alright. I don’t come here often, but I defentily do remember Romeo. He was a good guy, he even asked his wife a few things for me about HR stuff if I remember correctly.

So yes tomorrow will be day 5 and I honestly can’t see it getting much worst, I really hope im not wrong. Either way I will update and let you all know. I’m not the type of person who is too proud to be honest and say “well that didn’t work” “back to the drawing board” I know what I did probably wasn’t considered “the best way” I just hope everyone understands that I tried the taper and that’s not for me, it was jumping off or staying on for life and I’m not kidding.

I guess it’s the addicts in us that we always want more, at least that’s the case for me. From reading I may be an exception but the more sub I took the better I felt. I know about the whole ceiling thing but for me I always wanted more. It started getting so bad that I was running out of my subs about a week before I could get another script. I would actually buy some off the “street” just to tied me over even though I was being prescribed 12mgs ED. I know that sounds pathetic but after 20 months I guess I just had to abuse something. I think subs actually became my DOC.

Anyway I feel completely at peace (ok almost completely) with the decision I made. I’m not that scared of withdraw to be honest at this point. Whats really starting to sink in is the long term. I need to find a way that I just don’t go and abuse something else, I guess unless it’s carrots or something lol but I’m thinking about changing up my mental doctor. Ive been with him for a long time now but he’s not really good, ok he’s not good at all with substance abuse. He’s just a general consoler. I think I need to get with a new consoler who knows what I’m going through and what im up against and maybe NA meeting. Anyway thanks a big bunch for listening and I wish everyone else the very best…I will make sure to update tomorrow, day 5 and let you know if anything has changed.

PS: also about the stopping smoking thing, well honestly now that I’m off subs I really don’t crave cigarettes anymore. I was never a huge smoker, I used to smoke about 10 marlboro lights a day. Then, when I went on sub I was averaging 2 packs a day. Not sure why but the subs made me smoke soooo much more. Now that the sub is almost out of my body, I can honestly say I could care less about cigarettes. IDK, might sound weird but I’m gonna roll with it!!!!!

You are fierce dude. You can do it--just get pissed at the whole thing and say screw it and tough it out. Thats what I had to do. I was out of money, pills and patience. I was sick of being a slave to this nasty tasting orange pill. Im with you bro. Lemme know if I can help. PM me anytime dude.

Standing by,

brian

Hey substation,

You've already got some great advice, but I'll jump in anyway.

Yeah, I jumped from a high dose too. Like you and Brian, I could not taper. Romeo tapering = HAHAHAHA!! I tried a few times and always ended up screwing it up, so it was jump or be on it for life and I chose to jump.

I quit coffee when I quit Suboxone too, I also quit eating at McDonalds twice a day. I think the wd from the McDonalds food was the worst part!! LOL!! Mmm, loved my McDonalds breakfast!!

I hear ya on the wanting to cry thing, wd seems to shred some us emotionally. It's part of the process man.

It looks like today is day 5 for you, I can't see it getting a lot worse than it is now either. My wd peaked on day 10, but the difference between day 5 and day 10 was NOT huge. You actually sound like you're doing pretty damn good, you have a great attitude and I think that's gonna continue to help you quite a lot.

Listen, I abused my Suboxone too. Thank God I never ran out early, but almost every frickin' appointment I had taken my last pill the day before. I was ALWAYS so nervous driving to my doctor, wondering if she was out sick that day, if she had closed up shop and moved her practice elsewhere, wondering if she had been in an accident and couldn't get to the office. All manner of crazy went through my head as I would drive to my doctor. I would drive my wife nuts the week leading up to the appointment by worrying her that my shady doctor probably left town on me.

You're right, you need to find a way that you don't just go abuse something else. It's easy to let our addict minds take over again because then you're gonna end up in a shitstorm. Personally, I've been attending NA, it's helped me, but it's kinda rigid for my tastes. I've just started checking out SMART recovery and I like it a lot. I'll tell you this, you need to get a support group in place. You need a few people, preferrably recovering addicts, who you can call anytime. I've used the hell out of my support group and they've helped me tons. When I did relapse, they helped pull my butt out of the fire quick.

BTW, I'm 1 year, 3 months and 12 days off of Suboxone and even though I've had 3 short lapses in that time, I'm completely happy with my decision to quit.

Like Brian said, you're fierce man. There are several of us who jumped from high doses and we made it. It's hard work, but you can do it!!
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Be kind to yourself. Our character defects do NOT define who we are!

Hey Substation,

As Romeo said, You've already gotten some great advice here. I jumped at 8mgs 27 days ago, and like others, tapering could never have been a realistic option for ME.

But what really caught my attention here was the fact that I cannot stand coffee anymore either. I drank that stuff from the time I woke, right up until about 3 or 4 in the afternoon, right along with smoking up to two packs a day.

Now I can't drink coffee, at all. One pack of smokes is lasting me 3 days and I have this 24 hour a day overwhelming urge to eat steak. I've always been more of a fish, chicken, salad kinda guy, but now I guess my body wants STEAK and I'm already thinking about my next meal before I'm finished with what I'm eating right now.

Stay tough Substation! I'm a big ole' sissy and made it through with the help of all these guys here, Romeo, Brian etc. There were many, many days during the first 10-14 that I'd have to excuse myself from my office or my sofa to go find someplace to hide and cry like a baby for 10-15 minutes, collect myself, and carry on.

I'm approaching the 30 day mark now and even got a full night's sleep last night for the first time without any help.

I'll be here rootin' for ya too!
-RSJ

P.S. a couple days ago I walked through my kitchen and my partner was making himself a glass of Tang, I caught a whif of it and thought I was going to hurl right there on the spot.

OH MY GOD!!!! There are way too many similarities here that I’m reading it’s insane. First I must comment on McDonalds two times a day! Man oh man seriously bro that is withdrawal right there. I’m sure you probably seen the movie super size me….or were you in it Romeo??? Anyway I must confess I freakin LOVE McDonalds breakfast as well. Now there lunch/dinner uhm not so much.

Anywho…another crazy similarity is the total freaking out the day week before leading up to my appointment as well. I can’t tell you how many times I was scared my sh8tcan doctor was going to bail or be out sick. I don’t like to talk bad about doctors in general but my sub doc was a piece of dog crap, straight up. That’s another story but she didn’t care the slightest bit about me. I actually work with doctors for a living and I can say I know PLENTY of GREAT doctors, but not her. I remember one time after being a patient for 12-14 months, perfect attendance lol and past every single drug screening. I went down the shore and took 5 subs with me. I lost them and actually had to cut my vacation short because I couldn’t dare live without them. This had never happened to me in the 12-14 months I had been seeing her. I called and told her my situation and she said “well too bad” “you will be fine” I actually asked her if she was able to write an extra script for the 7 and she said YES, but she wouldn’t. I have many other stories and will not bore you with them but I hate to sound mean but she can burn in hell.

Anyway, yes today is day 5 with no sub!!!!! And I’m soooo freaking happy. I am in pain, but I don’t care. I know it will be worth it in the end. I see definite light at the end of the tunnel. I can’t bash subs because they did what they said they would do…it kept me off oxy/hydro for 20 months now, but now it’s time to turn a new leaf in my life. Its crazy because im just thinking about all the things im gonna do when I feel better. I find myself laughing my ass off at the craziest little things on TV. I can’t wait to go out pumpkin picking, I have my first niece/nephew on the way…it’s just looking better and better. I will say the toughest part is at night with the RLS. It was HORRIBLE last night. I found sleeping on the couch worked much better than the bed…IDK. Anyway thanks evyone for the support! I will continue to update as I come along in this crazy process.

PS: thanks Romeo for the tip on SMART…I will need to look that up. I also found NA meeting to not fit my profile. I hope this SMART is in my area and if so im defiantly down to try it out!

PPS: Every single last one of you are great people for helping out others. I truly hope to be one of you someday. I would like to stay on this forum more often and not just leave when I feel better….if that makes sense.

OMGosh you made me laugh when you asked me if I was in that movie "Super Size Me" Laughing

Check this out, I ate McDonalds twice a day for 13 years (the whole time I was on opiates) and never strayed more than 10 or so pounds from my ideal weight. Everytime I went in to get my cholesterol checked, my numbers were perfect. I'm just an awesome physical specimen I guess?? LMAO!!!

Dang it dude, I can't believe your doctor told you that she could write the script for 7 extra pills, but that she wouldn't........Bee-aw-tch!!!

I hear ya on not being able to bash Suboxone, when I first got off of Suboxone I hated it with a vengenance because of the wd, but then I realized I was completely opiate free......and believe me, I tried quitting Vicoden, I tried quitting OxyContin and I always ended up sucking pavement so hard that I got back on them after very short periods. Suboxone enabled me to get my head straight enough for long enough and here I am, off of opiates. It still stuns the crap out of me when I say I'm opiate free, I NEVER, EVER thought I'd be able to do it.

My RLS got pretty bad at night too, I found working my legs out pretty hard for even a few minutes would give me freedom from RLS for up to 2.5 hours. Some people swear by Magnesium too, IDK, I never tried the Magnesium?

Lastly, I hope you decide to institute a rigorous recovery program. Imagine getting back on opiates after all of the shit that you've been through?? It can happen man, it almost happened to me during my second relapse. I had taken Vic's for just over a week and I did NOT want to quit.....through the grace of God and some amazing friends, I made it back.
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Be kind to yourself. Our character defects do NOT define who we are!

Thanks for the support everyone….I just woke up from a nap and it was the first time I thought about ‘relapsing’ I woke up in a horrible mood. I was trying to figure out why I was putting myself through such hell when I could just grab some sub from my cabinet and be fine within an hour. Well, I didn’t do it…but it was really really scary I guess being it was the first time I even remotely considered jumping back on. Ive been awake for about an hour right now and the feeling has pretty much passed. It’s even helping just typing right now. Im NOT going to give up! I’m basically half way through the ‘toughest’ part.

I’m now headed out for a bit for only the second time since Sunday. Im driving 45 minutes to Philadelphia to pickup my favorite pizza. Yes, I drive that long for this pizza I have been for years. It will give me some outside time and a treat for the end. On another note it’s funny because im someone who always watched what they ate but I could care less right now. Im eating whatever the heck I want during this withdrawal process! Anyway just checking in….thanks a lot for the words of encouragement, please keep them coming!

PS: Romeo you got me thinking about McDonald’s breakfast the whole day now. Think that may be on the agenda for tomorrow. You think I can throw around your name for a discount?

Substation, I have to say your posts are amazing. Not only do they make sense, but they have perfect spelling & grammar, and even some humor! Could anyone detoxing from oxy even drag themselves to the computer let alone type something coherent or even think about cracking a joke? You are living proof that Sub withdrawal IS doable and not the worst withdrawal of any opiate like some people claim. I hope posting here is helping you. It sure is helping those of us who are hoping to go off soon to feel more positive. I know you feel crappy, but hang in there - everything you are talking about, the appetite, the crying, the laughing, it all sounds healthy. So keep up the good work!

Substation, I have to say your posts are amazing. Not only do they make sense, but they have perfect spelling & grammar, and even some humor! Could anyone detoxing from oxy even drag themselves to the computer let alone type something coherent or even think about cracking a joke? You are living proof that Sub withdrawal IS doable and not the worst withdrawal of any opiate like some people claim. I hope posting here is helping you. It sure is helping those of us who are hoping to go off soon to feel more positive. I know you feel crappy, but hang in there - everything you are talking about, the appetite, the crying, the laughing, it all sounds healthy. So keep up the good work!

Lilly, Lilly, Lilly….what can I say? Well this I can say. I am really touched by your comment that I am helping people out, I really had no idea and that’s a great added bonus. My intention was to get the help I needed and come back and help others later, but if my posting helps others as well, then winner, winner, chicken dinner!

Seriously though you’re making me think your right. All the times I wd’d from oxy it was hell and I would never be on my laptop right now. I must confess this is my second time jumping off and last time was much harder and I can’t explain why. I’m not trying to discourage anyone by any means, it’s just something im trying to wrap my head around. I guess it could be any amount of different things that influence your recovery. I mean I don’t have like some huge secret but I wish I did and I would share WITH ALL. Either way I must agree that suboxoe wd isn’t really all that bad, at least for me.

Anyway I got back from my favorite pizza place and I must say the strangest things are happening with my mind. I am recalling all kinds of things from the past both good and bad. I drove myself and I was sobbing thinking about friends I missed, x-girlfriends I missed and also the good times I had with them. I haven’t really thought about this girl in 5 years and now I’m missing the hell out of her. It’s almost like life stopped while I was on oxy and honestly even subs. In one hand its such a good thing to feel all these feelings again but at the same time I feel like I wanna bottle some of them up!

Anyway that’s about it for day 5. Tomorrow is day 6 and all I have to say is BRING IT ON BABY, BRING IT ON!!!!!

substation ". man........... i'm still on 16 to 22mg past 17 months. and like romeo/you/brian-t and others. have to jump. it looks like me some day, but with a few more years on ya all? i detoxed my self from 60mg oxy-contin- 3 years ago in bed for 2 t 5 days i think, my vains felt like they were being stretched out and puld apart and the other shit. i recovered in about 6 days. man i cant believe you jumped 12mg 5 days ago and all ready driving to philly. i hope i can fuk'n do this some day,but i guess i'm just not ready yet................

Hey Substation, Sounds like you're doin' great so far. Dude you are STRONG. I personally (and have said this in other posts) could not have made it where I am right now knowing that there was a sub ANYWHERE within a 100 mile radius of me. Just proves you have one HELL of a strong constitution. Tonight I went out and reconnected with some old friends (sober ones) that I isolated myself from for the past couple of years and I have to say, I had the BEST time, and have plans for tomorrow to do the same... I'm going to say this cautiously and optimistically, but reconnecting with my old -RSDSOBER, non addicted friends has been the SO therapeutic! Once again, I have laughed SO hard tonight and had such a great time being ME, the "old" ME... just ME... LOVE IT!
-RSJ

ya man i'm drinking coffee 8 to 5p.m. 3 packs a day. and crave dunkin donuts at 3 a.m.chocolate. keep truckin substation you got what it take's God speed.

Hey substation,

I wanna wish you all the blessings and luck that you can possibly have while you go through this. The good thing about this forum is that everybody here has been through what you are going through, and some of us have been successful. The proof is right here in the pudding, that coming off sub or whatever you're on can be done. The thing about sub that people don't realize until they try to come off, is that suboxone requires withdrawls, just like everything else. They don't tell you that when they put you on it. It's a drug that'll put an addict in check and QUICKLY stop the dope fiend behavior. It works for that, but it's really a legal substitution for an illegal substance. Accepting suboxone as a treatment for addiction is kind of like this, "The only way out of this horror story is through withdrawel...Do you wanna withdraw now?...or do you wanna withdraw later?" It gives you the opportunity to get your life back, but when it's time to come off of it, your life goes back to shit. You can't function, work, think, or MOVE damnit. It's almost worth it to withdraw from your d.o.c. and be done with it. That's my take on it.

I took a month and a half off work. You CANNOT have a lot on your plate when you do this. It's not just physical, but it's mental. You're gonna need time to heal both. Do you have a therapy group? You need a professional therapy group to support you through this. My insurance covered it and I had to pay $15.00 per session. There will be everyday, down to earth people, who suffer from some sort of addiction there who will be able to support you with your issues. Make sure you work closely with your primary care physician or psychiatrist. He/she can provide you with the NON-ADDICTIVE medicine that can help you through this. I'm 7 months clean and you can be too. It's really really hard as I'm sure you already know, but it can be done.

God Bless You and the best of luck to you!

Johnboy – hey I was on for 20 months sounds like your right behind me but it certainly isn’t a race. Listen don’t rush things it will only make things harder for you. You will know when it’s your time and we will be here to help you along the way.

RsjxRsj – you bring up two very good points that I was pondering as well. First, yes I don’t like having the subs in the cabinet right now. I’m strong enough to not take them but I find I’m NOT strong enough to throw them out. Almost like I’m keeping a safeguard in case I fail. Second, is about reconnecting with friends. I was actually going to make a new thread someday about this. I personnel feel I blocked out a lot of friends (clean) in my life during my recovery. I’m missing them now. Guess I was just wondering if others have done the same. Now I need to hope they will understand.

Foundhelp – nothing to say except thanks for the support. I agree with everything you wrote.

Laddertipper – What in God’s good name is wrong with nails for breakfast? lol JK Thanks for the words of encouragement. I’m moving along fairly well right now. Yes I may be some kind of exception but I think it’s more because I hate the sub right now more than I hate the pain. Believe me, I need to reassure myself of that very often lately. Also it would be awesome if I’m helping others while I’m being helped. I can’t imagine a better situation!

So day 6, day 6 man oh man what to say, what to say. Well I noticed a trend that might help someone else. Every time I wake up from sleep I can’t even remotely understand why I’m putting myself through this crap. I mean I got plenty more sub, doctor had no intention of cutting me of anytime soon. Lord knows she wanted the money. What am I doing? Just keep taking the delicious orange pill!!!!! But hang tight guys/gals that will pass. After about an hour of waking up I realize fully why I’m putting myself through this crap. Point of the story is if you’re anything like me, stay away from the subs when your first wake up and re-evaluate an hour later.

Anyway I must admit today was the worst day so far. I’m not really experiencing any mental issues it’s ALL physical. My stomach is killing me and my legs will not stop moving on their own and I can barely stand without getting tired. I’m doing well though, honestly that’s all of my symptoms and I can battle with them. I feel fortunate that it’s not as bad as it could have been. Now going back to work Monday….ouch…guess I will cross that bridge when I get there, but I see it in the soon distance. Thanks again everyone!