Sometimes, I just need to get high, like now
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Sometimes, I just need to get high, like now
Posted: 08/25 07:13 AM
...but, I keep telling myself that I can't.
I'm sure that it didn't help that I stayed up until 1am reading "Pill Head." My purpose for reading the book was a good one. I wanted to see how much I could relate. Am I really completely an addict? That question often dogs me. Any definitive pronouncement that I make in admitting that I am, is challenged regularly by my thinking and then the doubts return.
When I read, "This is what I've been waiting for my whole life. Three Vicodin. That was all it took. I was in love," I couldn't believe that my first opiate experience was in print... by someone else. My gut quivered and knotted and I shook. I was probably drooling, though I think that I wiped at my nose. I should have returned the book to the library shelf that very moment. But, I didn't.
Ohhh.... I remember that first day when all it took was three hydros! And that's what attaches to my brain and makes me unable to get the thought of using out of my mind. I have to force myself to remember that within two months, I was scamming and stealing because I progressed to ingesting 110mg of oxy at a time and, frustratingly, was not able to get high.
It sucks that I metabolize opiates and build a tolerance as quickly as I do. Although I never want to want to use, I often feel that life's been unfair. I shouldn't have this much of a problem with opiates after such a short period of abusing them.
But, it is what it is. So, I have to remind myself that I don't want to become a liar and a thief again.
It's just that I miss the feeling SO MUCH sometimes.
I've been on about 3mg a day of Sub for the past few weeks. I alternate days: 4mg and then 2mg which averages out to 3mg a day. I looked at the calendar this morning, hoping that I had taken only 2mg yesterday. Hmmmm... maybe that's part of why I'm obsessing like I am. But, I took 4mg yesterday. Today, I get only a quarter of a tab.
I want to take a whole tab, just to see if the extra bupe would sate some of the need to disconnect. Of course, Josh (the author of Pill Head) abused Suboxone in rehab. I was freakin' jealous of him last night. I never really felt high from my Suboxone. But.... my thoughts keep wondering: "Am I just enough below the threshhold that a boost in the amount of Sub would bring some relief of this obsession?".
I don't know if I think that typing this will help get some of this out of my system. I went to a morning AA meeting, hoping that would happen, but I feel just as fixated as I did before going.
What I would give to have a normal brain that never screamed to get high!
Posted: 08/25 07:24 AM
I'm sorry you're having such a rough time right now. It's my understanding that at your dose you're right around the ceiling. This might account for the reason you're having cravings. It might be worth considering raising your dosage (of course with your doctor) to 5-6 mg. That might help. Stopping the cravings is one of the biggest benefits of suboxone, so it occurs to me that you're only getting partial benefit from being on suboxone. Granted, some people don't have cravings at 3-4 mg, but there are just as many people who do. (4 mg is largely considered to be at or around the ceiling.)
You mentioned how when you are thinking about getting high you're trying to force yourself to remember what happens to you when you are using. I think that's very smart of you. I think 12-step programs refer to that as something like "playing the tape all the way through". In other words think of EVERYTHING that happens when you use, not just the "feeling' but also the consequences. So like I said, I think you're smart to do this.
Hang in there and please keep us posted.
Posted: 08/25 09:40 AM
I am so glad you posted this. I think ALL of us addicts feel this way from time to time. I know I have.
But now, since I have been on 8 mg of sub daily, this type of thinking goes away pretty fast for me. The last time I felt this way was about a month ago. So I did some laundry, posted a bit about it, talked about it at my relapse prevention place, and totally forgot about it. (Until now when you brought it up!) So because of this, I wonder if your dose is just a bit too low. I mean this is just my experience ya know? I am no sub doc. I just dont have powerful thoughts about using anymore. They are just fleeting now, in and out of my brain.
I have also made some other changes in my life. You kinda remined me of this Christin.....I don't read books like that anymore. I used to LOVE reading shit like that. And watching the drug movies.....I just don't do it anymore (4 whole months LOL) I guess I am kinda scared that they would make me feel just like you did. I also used to LOVE listening to my hard rock station in the car. Now, it all kinda sounds like doom and gloom to me ya know? So I just started listening to news raido or some more up beat shit. It kinda works dude! ( I still play my Disturbed CD though......"Down With the Sickness" is the best song on earth!)
I think you are doing the right thing by talking about it and trying to use some AA techinques to get through it. Talking to your doc cant hurt either.
Are you on that dose of sub because you can't afford more? Or are you just trying to wean down? I would love to know as I am going to go down to 6mg this month. I think 8mg is not necessary for me.
So please post again. I would love to hear from you! Kire
reading and watching stuff with people using drugs
Posted: 08/25 02:07 PM
I think Kire's right, we ALL experience what you're talking about.....I too used to love reading about drugs, watching movies with drug use, and also listening to songs with references to drugs.....but you know what? watching movies and so on that had really accurate accounts of the WORST parts of addiction really helped me...watching the later episodes of The Sopranos for instance, where one of the characters was having a relapse--it just showed some of the ugliest and accurate portrayals of an addict using and addict being high. I'm not recommending anyone to seek out more shows or books with using in 'em but I just wanted to share that for me, the ones that show accurate portrayals of the ugliest parts actually seems to be able to make me feel disgusted about the idea of using instead of making me want to use. Trainspotters was one movie and also the movie about Jim Carroll's early life (I forget the name of that movie). Again, I'm not recommending, it's just that those did it for me--showed the worst most ugly and most un-fun parts of using heroin--and not just withdrawals--the ugly parts of using....
Other than that, Christin, I too have struggled with my sub dose and I wish I could get high on it, I have the same thoughts about trying to get below the ceiling or even stopping sub for a while ....so...you're not alone and you sound like you're doing WELL with it--I know it's hard, incredibly hard...and it's hard to just wait for it to get easier, I know. But with time it really really should get better....Aren't you about 1 year off drugs? (sorry if I've got it wrong). Well, the first year has GOT to be the hardest, so it really should start getting some easier for you, regarding cravings. Meanwhile, well, I guess we just have to do the best we can to distract ourselves when we're in the middle of the obsessive thoughts. And I too think Hatmaker has a good point, maybe you should talk to your doctor about your dosage. For me, I think it's probably essential that I stay above the ceiling level, at least for now.
Anyway, I wish you luck, I hope you start feeling better soon....distraction.....getting involved in something that takes your concentration--I know that can help. I wish I could be of more help. But Christin...you are an inspiration to me becasue you are fighting so hard and...winning too. Thanks for posting.
Posted: 08/25 04:30 PM
Thanks for the replies and the encouragement and, yes, autononymous, I’ve been on Suboxone for a little over a year (July 30 was 1year). Until this past Spring, I was on 16mg. I was amazed by how well it took care of the cravings. Since tapering this spring, I’ve had a few “relapses,” two on alcohol and one on trams & flexeril. This is better than my first try at Sub, which was 6 months earlier. I was started on 12mg and began tapering right away. I can’t say that I recall having more than a few days without cravings. Within two months, I had relapsed back onto oxy.
Although my current doctor doesn’t advertise a 90-day treatment plan, he doesn’t believe in keeping people on Sub for “a long period of time” either. (He sees that as switching one addiction for another). So, I’ve been tapering since April. Although I ideally would like to get off Sub, it seems that every time I get below 4mg, the “fleeting thoughts” of using become obsessive and I start to feel desperate. Maybe you all know what I mean when I say that the thoughts are like thinking about how much you need to breathe when someone’s trying to suffocate you.
Today, I caved and took a full 8mg tablet. I haven’t taken that much at one time in a few months. But, part of me thinks that it was the right thing to do. After all, afterward, I knew that I was blocked, no question about it. Of course, I also knew that, deep down, I was hoping that I would feel something from the extra milligrams, even though I really knew that wasn’t possible.
I appreciate all the replies and what you’ve shared. I’ve been feeling fairly level-headed this afternoon and evening. I hope to return to my 4mg/2mg/4mg/2mg schedule tomorrow, though I don’t want to push too hard because evan as okay as I feel right now, it’s almost as though I have an ominous cloud above me, just waiting for me to become vulnerable so that it can rain down a storm that will drown me.
Posted: 08/25 05:04 PM
|christin wrote: |
|Maybe you all know what I mean when I say that the thoughts are like thinking about how much you need to breathe when someone’s trying to suffocate you |
You express the feeling so well! I am going to put my personal opinion out there for just a moment and you can take it or leave it (I won't be offended either way). I disagree with your doctor's philosophy on trading one drug for another with suboxone. I do not think of suboxone like this at all. I am taking a drug in order to remain in remission from addiction and without this drug, my disease of addiction will return full force. The "trading" philosophy suggests there is a choice. You accurately equate a craving as being suffocated of oxygen. A necessity for life. What choice is there in that? You aren't imagining that sensation. It isn't in your head. It isn't because you have some character defect that makes you think of it that way. It is chemical and biological and likely genetic.
Are there people who are able to maintain a remission long term without suboxone? Yes. Some. But it isn't easy and all people can't be expected to do that in 90 days or even a year of trying. Suboxone is a tool to get you there. Someone with diabetes might be able to enter remission without insulin eventually. But that takes time and effort and skill and knowledge in order to re-learn behaviors and foods and exercise, etc. Doctors don't say "well let me give you some insulin for 90 days and then you need to be off of it because you are just taking (trading) insulin in exchange for calorie reduction. No. They are given the insulin and counseled on how to reduce the severity and possibly on how to enter a remission. If the patient does this then great. If they do not then they keep prescribing the insulin.
I know some people don't like to equate addiction with diabetics, etc. But I think it makes the point well and I just think you have a medical condition. A doctor needs to treat it and you in whatever way is the most likely to be healthy for you and the most likely to result in success. You walking around feeling like you need air all the time is bound to result in a relapse despite your best intentions and best efforts. Not to say you can't do this because it is possible that you can. I wouldn't want to place limits on anyone. I also think that these expectations are quite high and not everyone can live up to them so easily. I encourage you to do whatever you think is most likely to keep you from relapsing and if for a while that means you need to take a higher dose of sub or get a different doctor and take this slowly, then this doesn't mean there is something wrong with your character. It means you just need more time and if that is what you need then you should take it without feeling guilty and without feeling like a failure. It would be a balanced choice. A solid choice. A healthy choice. Either way.
Posted: 08/25 05:10 PM
One of the great things about "the program" or any type of recovery that involves changing the inside is that I've gotten to know myself. I know my strengths and shortcomings, I know my limitations. I am approaching 7 years sober, with the help of suboxone, and I still get those thoughts. I still remember the high and still miss it sometimes. On 24 mg of sub or 3 mg I am still a drug addict. I think about coke, amp, heroin, ect... atleast once a week. I know if I was not on sub I would eventually give in. This is just who I am and something I will probably always deal with. Don't get me wrong, I don't have over powering cravings or thoughts but I always loved to get high from the time I was 13. What your feeling is completely normal. It's big of you to confess your thoughts. When you get some years in the program your the one people come to for answers and your the one who speaks at meeting when the lead doesn't show up so it's hard sometimes to talk about my cravings when people think I have it all figured out. Hatmaker mentioned "playing the tape through" and that's exactly what I try to do to this day. I think past the high and think of the jails, rehabs, and shady characters I'd have to be around. Don't fight the thoughts or let them get you down just remember to do the right thing when they come up. I've always said "any addict that says they don't think about using once in a while is lying" IMO anyway.
One more thing, I found it alot easier to take 3 mg a day than to split 2 and 4. It's easy with the 2 mg tabs. Give it a try, as much of a pain as it can be breaking pills in halves and quarters, I always adjusted faster that way when lowering.
Posted: 08/25 05:13 PM
Hi again christin - I hope you don't mind me saying this, but I think it's a damn shame that your doctor - someone who is treating your for addiction - doesn't seem to understand how your treatment works. Suboxone is hardly another addiction - a dependency, yes, but not an addiction.
I'm not saying you should stay on it long term - that's obviously your call. You know what you need better than anyone. But if you decide you're not quite ready to taper off you might want to think about getting a new doctor. It just seems like you're still struggling at low doses. Going off sub in that state of mind must be a bit scary.
Whatever you decide I wish you the very best.
Posted: 08/25 08:53 PM
I agree hatmaker, I was thinking the same thing but wasn't sure how to put it in words.
Posted: 08/26 06:50 AM
This seems to be the case of the doctors in my area. We only have three that prescribe, one is a cash only business and the other is never accepting patients because his patients all come through the hospital rehab (something I never did).
|hatmaker510 wrote: |
|...I think it's a damn shame that your doctor - someone who is treating your for addiction - doesn't seem to understand how your treatment works. |
I've had two of these doctors and it seems to me that the only one who knows what he's doing is the one I've never had treat me.
Yes, it is a lot scary and I get the impression that my doctor doesn't think that there's any physical component to my addiction anymore, at least not after being on Suboxone. At my last visit, he said,"After being on Suboxone for awhile the addiction is all psychological."
|It just seems like you're still struggling at low doses. Going off sub in that state of mind must be a bit scary. |
I don't think that I'll try to go under 4mg just yet and wait until my next visit when I'll ask to be prescribed the 2mg tab so that I can do as (I think that it was) Smoothy recommended... 3mg on all days. I've been doing 2/4/2/4 because it's far too hard to break an 8mg tab into 1mg doses. It's hard enough getting anywhere near an accurate 2mg dose.
I'm so glad that I'm feeling better today. At this morning's AA meeting, an addict shared about getting a Vicodin script last night. I shared that yesterday morning or the night before, I would have done almost anything (hell, anything) to get his script. He had said that he hadn't filled it but was thinking about it (because he legitimately has pain, though, after the meeting, he confessed that he's considering selling the pills).
Although there definitely is still a pull, an interest that I don't want to have, at least I'm not fighting that desperation that sucks me in so deep that the "tools" that I've been told to use seem impossibly out of my reach. I much prefer being in a place where I'm able to be around a guy thinking of filling and selling his script and tell him that if he does, I'd rather not know.... From suboxforum.com